13:47
(+4)
Ramsay Bolton:
The wife and brother of Lady Cerwyn were killed by Ramsay Bolton - their flayed bodies were hung on display from the walls of Moat Cailin.
(Kill of Unnamed Character)
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Seriously contesting all of Ramsay's kill points. Does it count if it happens off-screen, before the character's first scene in the episode? If so, don't we need to count implied kills whenever a character is in a battle? This is setting a weird precedent, I think. -alicehanners
nyan and megharr36 like this -
Yeah, I think there's a reasonable debate on both sides of this. I think if Ramsay simply *said* he killed these people, it wouldn't count. However in this case, we're shown all three flayed bodies in the scene preceding this one. So the precedent would be that we are shown bodies + details of the kill (enough to confirm the killer).
Some previous examples of this:
S1E2: The Hound credited with a kill after he returns with Mycah's body, though we never see the actual kill.
S1E7: Robert credited with the boar kill after he tells the story about it - we never see the actual kill (though I believe the boar is later shown?).
S2E7: Theon credited with 2 kills after we are shown the two charred bodies of the orphan boys in Winterfell - we never see the actual killing.
S2E8: Jaqen credited with 4 kills of Lannister soldiers at Harrenhal. We never see the actual killing.
S2E8: Dagmer credited with 2 kills after he tells Theon about the farmer and wife that he also killed along with the orphan boys. We actually don't even see bodies in this case.
S2E9: Ser Mandon Moore catches 3 deserters, and Cersei orders all three of them to be executed (and Ilyn Payne heads off to do so). In hindsight this is strong candidate to be rescinded, as there's no actual confirmation.
S4E10: Daenerys is credited for Drogon's kill of the Meereenese villager's daughter. We are shown the charred bones of the girl, but are never shown the actual kill.
I think there's a fair argument to take a hard line and say only explicit on-screen kills count, but that would invalidate most of the above examples. Other lines could be drawn at "must be shown the body" and/or "must get explicit details to determine who did the kill." I'm open to hearing opinions on where the kill cutoff is, but either way it sounds like we'll definitely get a new precedent established for the rulebook, which is always great. -nyan
moonbaseu92, tim.sheehan, Reaper, alicehanners like this
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