Matchup: The Titans vs You Know Nothing Jon (Targaryen) Snow for Ep 1

The Titans (sammotgnouy)

Character	Drafted	Total	Kills	Politics	Insults	Wine	Sex	Thrones	Deaths	Special	Feels
Gilly A daughter of Craster, a wildling who lived in a fortified compound north of the Wall. She and her baby escaped to Castle Black with Samwell Tarly.	#42	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0
Areo Hotah The personal bodyguard for Doran Martell.	#55	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0
Hodor Hodor hodor Hodor hodor Hodor hodor Hodor hodor Hodor hodor Hodor hodor Hodor. hodor.	#23	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0
Jaime Lannister The second of the Lannister children, he is Cersei's lover and twin brother, and also the father of her three children. He also serves as Lord Commander of the Kingsguard.	#7	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0
Denys Mallister A member of the Night's Watch and commander of the Shadow Tower, located the west end of the Wall.	#58	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0
Gendry A bastard son of Robert Baratheon, although this fact is not widely known (even to Gendry himself). After being captured by Melisandre, he is freed by Ser Davos and escaped Dragonstone by rowboat. His whereabouts are currently unknown.	#39	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0
Stannis Baratheon The eldest brother of King Robert, he is the rightful heir to the Irone Throne.	#10	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0
Maester Aemon The Maester of the Night's Watch. In a previous life he was born Aemon Targaryen, a great-uncle of Daenerys.	#26	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0
Totals		0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0

You Know Nothing Jon (Targaryen) Snow (tjwillauer)

Character	Drafted	Total	Kills	Deaths	Special
Jon Snow The bastard son of Ned Stark, and a member of the Night's Watch. He helped lead the defense of Castle Black against the Wildling siege.	#3	13	10	0	3
Mance Rayder A former member of the Night's Watch, Mance leads a united Wildling army as the King Beyond the Wall. Following the Battle at Castle Black however, his forces were defeated and he was captured by Stannis Baratheon.	#19	10	0	10	0
Hizdahr zo Loraq A son of one of the Meereenese slave masters - he appears in Daenerys' court to ask for his fathers body, after Daenerys crucifies all of the slavers in Meereen.	#51	0	0	0	0
Rickon Stark The youngest of the Stark children. He splits off from Bran and travels with Osha to the Last Hearth, seat of House Umber.	#62	0	0	0	0
Theon Greyjoy Heir to the Iron Islands, and formerly a ward of House Stark. Theon is currently a captive of Ramsay Bolton.	#14	0	0	0	0
Ellaria Sand The former paramour of Prince Oberyn. She is also the mother of several of his bastard children, known as the Sand Snakes.	#30	0	0	0	0
Eddison Tollett A member of the Night's Watch. Edd commanded some of the forces on the Wall in the Battle at Castle Black.	#46	0	0	0	0
Barristan Selmy The former Lord Commander of the Kingsguard of Robert and Joffrey Baratheon. After being dismissed by King Joffrey, he joins Daenerys to serve as her advisor and Queensguard.	#35	0	0	0	0
Totals		23	10	10	3

Kills

52:44 (+10) Jon Snow:

Jon Snow gives Mance a mercy kill, shooting an arrow through his heart before he is consumed by a burning pyre. (Kill of Named Character)

8 more comments - see full thread

To explain more about the philosophy, one of the important parts of the scorekeeping is that it can objectively follow definitions, without requiring judgment calls on the part of some scorekeeper (which can be subjective). In this case, I agree with both of you that Stannis probably "deserves" some credit - without his actions, Mance wouldn't have been put in a position to be killed. But "put in a position to be killed" is a little murky to make a rule for - how do you draw the line? Is it really Melisandre that puts him in that position because she starts the fire burning?

Given that, I think it's better to stick to the scoring definitions, because there's no subjectivity to them. And sometimes it results in a "deserving" character losing points, but that's fantasy sometimes - just like a football RB who hauls his team to the goal line, only for the backup to sub in and score the 1yd touchdown. -nyan

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2015 Apr 14 moonbaseu92 and coconnor723 like this
I agree with Nyan. Riddle me this: If someone (King A) commands his executioner (Brute) to kill the shopgirl (Lass), and Lass flees to Other Country where she is run over by a cart and dies, does King A get the point? Everyone's actions contribute. The point is, Mance was killed by Jon Snow. Jon Snow was NOT commanded to kill him by Stannis. Therefore, it's not a commanded kill. -alicehanners

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2015 Apr 19
That's different because Mance didn't escape from the fire and run away while Jon shot at him to keep him from escaping. He was in the process of dying. Even if Jon hadn't intervened, he still would've been dead. I know Stannis won't get points for that, and I don't care, I'm just saying that I disagree with your example. -kas113

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2015 Apr 21 moonbaseu92 likes this

Deaths

52:55 (+10) Mance Rayder:

Mance stands on a burning pyre after he refuses to bend the knee to Stannis Baratheon. He is mercy killed with an arrow through the heart by Jon Snow. (Death)

Special

23:07 (+3) Jon Snow:

Melisandre announces Jon Snow to Stannis: "Your Grace. The bastard of Winterfell." (Special)

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